Cleveland Sports Forum

Hillbilly wrote:I think the Cavs have a team that could contend for a playoff spot. At least I thought they did until I saw them play defense this year. Or not play I should say.

HB - you hit the nail on the head there. I do agree that all the names listed in other posts sound pretty good and some young ones promising.

But I seem to remember the Cavs being a pretty bad defensive team LAST year! So it's bad, bad defense that will handcuff this team.

rusty - I totally think they told Love they'd sign him but if they tanked they'd accomodate him and move him at the deadline. His deal might actually make him easier to move to a contender if they send back a big salary (but with less years on it) and other assets. That type of thing.

OK this is non Cavs related (but NBA related) but it blew my mind!! Incredibly sophisticated!

Inside Blake Griffin’s ‘scientific’ offseason

James L. Edwards III Sep 26, 2018 16

Dwane​ Casey described​ it as​ “scientific.” Blake Griffin, with​ his nonchalant off-the-court​ demeanor, brushed off​ the​ idea that his​ summer workload​​ was as empirical as his new head coach made it out to be.

Though Griffin understood why Casey would think that.

“I just had a very, very clear plan,” the Detroit Pistons star said.

It was a regimen crafted by Griffin and Noah LaRoche, a sought-after trainer based in New Hampshire who owns Integrity Hoops and has worked with Russell Westbrook, Paul George, Victor Oladipo and Diana Taurasi in recent years. Shortly after the season ended, a mutual connection put the two in contact. Griffin detailed to LaRoche what he wanted to accomplish during his first healthy summer in three years. LaRoche got to work by examining Griffin’s film and stats, and constructed a proposal of his own based on his findings.

They had a meeting of the minds and ironed out a comprehensive plan centered around playmaking and read-and-react situations that was exercised over a four-month period. There was very little one-on-one work between the two.

“Jerry West told me very few players are legacy players,” LaRoche, 36, told The Athletic in a phone conversation. “I said, ‘What’s a legacy player?’ He said, ‘There are a lot of guys who are big-time athletes, there are a lot of guys who are super skilled, but legacy players see the game in slow motion and can make everyone else better and see things before they happen.’

“That’s a big thing for us. At the end of the day, the game is played with four other guys and you have to be able to lift those guys up. Everything we did was (based around) trying to find the best shot available, whether it’s for Blake or someone else.”

For up to five days a week — sometimes six, LaRoche said — the two spent around “70 to 90 minutes” going through a workout that analytical admirers would drool over. They shot-charted everything. However, it wasn’t as elementary as “make 10 from this spot.” LaRoche said he’d instead surround Griffin with coaches — both offensively and defensively — and force him to make a decision based on the situation.

LaRoche defines this as “engaged reps.” That means if Griffin had the ball, he had to decide if he had a shot; needed to make a pass and relocate; make a pass and then position himself for a shot; or make a move, or series of moves, before deciding what the best outcome would be.

Each drill was designed to simulate live-game action, and there were sprinklings of technical development, too.

“It’s constant thinking,” LaRoche said. “We try to put as much toll on the body and spark motor learning, the cognitive stuff. We want to see if he can make a decision.”

Along the same lines, LaRoche documented every little detail in a method he calls “live coding.” Griffin is the hub of the Pistons’ offense, so the purpose was to see how many touches he had per possession, how many dribbles he took per touch and how many points he scored per possession.

This, specifically, was a top priority heading into the offseason.

“When the ball slows down or I’m stuck with the ball, I think our offense is going to be worse,” Griffin said. “I think the more that the ball moves and the quicker decisions we make, the better off we’ll be. It’s important.”

The coaches, or “dummy defenders,” as Griffin described, would comb through his habits and force him into weaker positions. If they noticed something he needed to address, they’d hammer it home on the court. This allowed him to see the alternatives from every action.

“We’re like, for example — and I’m not saying this is true — ‘Hey, Blake has a habit of catching and driving left all the time, whether or not that’s the right play. So make sure you close out on his left hand so he starts driving right and reading that play,'” LaRoche said. “Trying to simulate stuff he and I felt he would see or struggle with.”

Every workout was filmed, and LaRoche gave Griffin the footage following each session. The video was detailed but meant to be more of a morale booster than a fixation on any wrongdoings.

“The psychology of going home at the end of the day and dwelling on the things we didn’t do or screwed up, rather than say, ‘I got a good workout in, I got my bills paid, I returned that book,’ we don’t think about that stuff,” LaRoche said. “Instead, you beat yourself up.

“Seventy percent (of the film) is positive reinforcement, and it’s like a two-minute breakdown of the positive things done. And then I’d say 20-30 percent were corrective stuff. We’d also send him film from his past season of things we’re working on or things he did well.”

Per Griffin’s request, LaRoche’s offseason plan didn’t just help the power forward improve his own personal development. Griffin also had a goal of making his teammates better. It all goes back to LaRoche’s conversation with West about how a player’s true talent is seen through the lense of his team’s success.

Griffin, more than anything, was motivated to make strides to better facilitate for his teammates.

“At the end of the day, when you work with these players, I think the point, for me, is how do they impact their team winning in the winter?” said LaRoche, a former Division III basketball player. “Everything really came down to that: How can Blake get better as an individual player but also how can he impact winning? That, in my mind, is what makes athletes great. The great athletes do that.”

LaRoche uses a similar method with all of his clients. As a result, he internally manifests an annual excitement. He evaluates his job performance solely on that of the players’ forthcoming seasons.

“In some ways I guess you could say I am a scientist because, now, you’re trying to see if your experiment worked,” said LaRoche, who insisted he was just a fraction of Griffin’s offseason army. “I’m very eager to see how he does and how the team does. I respect Coach Casey and I know a lot of those guys on staff. They work their butts off, and I suspect they’re going to have a good year.”

(Top photo: Paul Sancya/Associated Press)

James L. Edwards III is the Pistons writer for The Athletic Detroit. Previously, he was a reporter for the Lansing State Journal, where he covered Michigan State and high school sports. Follow James L. on Twitter @JLEdwardsIII.

Sounds like Griffin is the Trevor Bauer of basketball.

Korver may bring back a late first round pick or early 2nd round pick. Every contender will want him.

George Hill can bring back a player if a team needs a veteran PG. Especially in a 3 team deal.

Jr Smith is on an expiring contract. So is Frye so they have more value then just talent.

Thompson and Hood can both be interesting players for a contender.

Finally, Dan Gilbert is always ready to spend for the right piece.

This will be interesting lose or win.......

I agree for sure it will be interesting.

I admire them for giving it a shot with remaining veterans. Hey, Sexton looked good last night.

But the reality is a team built for Lebron is in trouble without him. Likewise the Lakers were NOT built for Lebron and they will struggle as a result as well. Until, like the Cavs, they find the pieces that fit.

Meanwhile the Nets trashed them at the Q! So while I admire them giving it a shot, arrows certainly point to the rebuild mode.

This will be interesting lose or win.......

It seems that the front office moves will be more interesting than what happens on the court this season.

Lakers now 1 up on the Cavs in the win column. Lebron was No, 3 on his team in scoring. That doesn't happened often. And only a double double.

I'm not a pro basketball fan but my son, who lives in LA, used to catch a few Laker games during the year. He says those are over now that the Lakers jacked up the prices because of LeBron.

And it continues losing to Detroit.

I did get to watch an entire game (without the WS on) and I will say the Cavs really battled. Credit to them without Kevin Love making it a game

They tossed up some 3s for the first time with Korver hitting a batch of them. Clarkson has been scoring well. The bench had much better +/- numbers overall.

They really went after this one civ.

Korver hit some really vintage shots for him.

Sexton definitely impressed - I didn't realize his court vision is that good. If he can dish like that his future is good because scoring is supposed to be his strength.

Really like Nance too. Poor guy was overmatched though at center with beasts like Andre Drummond and Blake Griffin crushing the boards for Detroit.

They could have used Love's rebounding as Drummond just dominated inside. 26 points and 22 rebounds for him..that's insane!

To me, again, it's defense and team chemistry. Guys like Clarkson and Hood are nice offensive talents but they don't pass much. Tristan is Tristan, his peak has passed. Cedi was a no show for this one.

Ty Lue has a whoooole new kettle of fish to deal with these days.

who do you view as [eventual] Quality NBA Team starters among this bunch? are Clarkson and Hood just good bench guys?

civ ollilavad wrote:who do you view as [eventual] Quality NBA Team starters among this bunch? are Clarkson and Hood just good bench guys?

Ok, I assume you mean out of the young guys. And of course, somewhat like baseball although probably even more so, a lot depends on their situation relative to a team need. Also young guys, like baseball, can be tough to predict.

So all those caveats out of the way.....

1. Clarkson to me is a 6th or 7th man on a quality team just for scoring off the bench. The guy has been in the league a few years now and that's all he does - defense is not his thing. Neither is passing. He scores really nicely though really a volume scorer not a great shooter.

2. Rodney Hood - exact same as Clarkson.

3. Nance Jr. - clearly the target in the LA deal - the Lakers included Clarkson just to offload his salary. This kid is great for today's game in that he can switch out to anyone defensively. Too small right now for center but in today's game can be serviceable there vs. small lineups (unlike Detroit last game). Still needs to develop his outside game too. But the athleticism and tools are there, and obviously the pedigree. Yes, destined to start for a quality team.

4. Cedi Osman - wow, tough call on this one. He has the savvy and smarts - sorta a poor man's Luca Doncic - a typical heady European player. Doncic and others have shown you don't need to be an athletic stud (and Osman is definitely not) to be a successful NBA player but Osman would have to find the right quality team that needs what he has - actually LAST year's Cavs might be a good example. Still not a great shooter. More of a swiss army knife type. I wouldn't bet on him starting for a quality team but jury is out because of his intangibles.

5. Sexton - he is still so raw and has only played a few games but I know he can take it to the hole and his outside shot isn't all that bad. Lots of rookies have to work on that and do! His court vision last game shows me he has that as well. I see what the Cavs saw and I think he has a very good shot to be that starter on a quality NBA team. Again, still very raw.

civ - really not glowing reviews except Nance Jr. and Sexton. Hood and Clarkson could be nice pieces for certain teams who want their scoring. So, to me, the cupboard is pretty bare (thank goodness they got a nice young piece last year in Nance and in Sexton in the draft).

One more thing their first rounder this year only works if they have a top 10 pick. Tanking is in their best interests.

I do not think they will have any problem finishing in the bottom 10. Probably bottom 5.... Maybe bottom 3...... Maybe.......

You got that right.

It's just how soon they stop pretending about this season and go full force tanking.

Sadly, some of those contracts (I see you TT) they are just stuck with and will slow all that down.

I'll say it again - they got their ring so it's all good. But the price is paid....now